Click to open network menu
Click to open network menu
Join or Log In
Search
To Top
Smitefire logo

Join the leading SMITE community.
Create and share God Guides and Builds.

Create an MFN Account






Or

MOBAFire WildRiftFire CounterStats DOTAFire HeroesFire VaingloryFire RuneterraFire FarmFriends ForzaFire LostArkFire

Loki Deals Too Much Damage

Please review our General Rules & Guidelines before posting or commenting anywhere on SmiteFire.

Thread Locked

This thread has been locked by the moderators, you cannot reply to it.

<< 1 3 5 6 7 8 9 10 13 16 >>
Forum
Forum » General Discussion » Loki Deals Too Much Damage 160 posts - page 7 of 16
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Firraria » July 21, 2014 11:26pm | Report
SweetTenderLove wrote:



This. I cant understand why people complain about Loki dealing too much damage because if you give a good ADC or just about any other assassin the same items around mid to late game, they're going to do very similar amounts of damage (assuming they are at the same level).


I disagree completely. I was doing a 3v3 and one of my friends was on the enemy team. He's a rank 10 Anhur and it's his best god. I was like a rank 2 Loki at the time, and I absolutely annihilated instantly him even though he was on par with me in terms of gold and XP. With full CDR, I could kill him twice before he could get his Aegis up if I acted fast. He could have built defense, but ADCs aren't flexible enough for that.

In my experience as a Loki player, it doesn't matter whether or not you feed Loki. If he's on par with you and gold and xp, he can kill you instantly unless you build defense, and ADCs just generally can't afford that.
Guides I have written:

The Complete Beginner's Guide to SMITE!

To Kill a Mockingbird of Nope: Sun Wukong Solo and Support Guide

A Guide to Xbalanque: The Hidden Jaguar

Fenrir: The Ultimate Jungle Guide

Arachne: The Ultimate Jungle Guide
If my post helped you out,
then drop me a +rep! :D
Firraria
<Skullcracker>

Awards Showcase
Show more awards

Distinguished (58)
Posts: 980
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Raventhor » July 21, 2014 11:30pm | Report
Firraria wrote:



I disagree completely. I was doing a 3v3 and one of my friends was on the enemy team. He's a rank 10 Anhur and it's his best god. I was like a rank 2 Loki at the time, and I absolutely annihilated instantly him even though he was on par with me in terms of gold and XP. With full CDR, I could kill him twice before he could get his Aegis up if I acted fast. He could have built defense, but ADCs aren't flexible enough for that.

In my experience as a Loki player, it doesn't matter whether or not you feed Loki. If he's on par with you and gold and xp, he can kill you instantly unless you build defense, and ADCs just generally can't afford that.

That's why positioning matters in this game. Everyone can oneshot you very easily without positioning (see release-date Chang'E for the most mindless instagib ever)

People look at numbers too much and not practicality/positioning.
-Demolibium

Raventhor
<Moderator>

Awards Showcase
Show more awards

Eminent (158)
Posts: 2975
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Devampi » July 22, 2014 3:15am | Report
I got some sort of fix for the stealth. give sentry wards and tower true sight (like in dota) then invis would be revealed until they walk out of the sight range.
Devampi
<Veteran>

Awards Showcase
Show more awards

Renowned (105)
Posts: 4410
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by dacoqrs » July 22, 2014 5:18am | Report
The problem really is, if you touch his damage, he'll become useless. Because if you don't kill someone right away, you'll get cced and die everytime.

I don't know how I feel about Loki. At some point, yes his damage is certainly incredible, but he has SO many downsides... no teamfight presence, squishy, terrible when focused..

I think Loki is fine the way he is. Because when someone is a bad Loki, they don't do well (I've seen it before, especially in Arena) and when someone is a good Loki, they're hard to beat! Isn't that how a balanced god should work?
Thanks to Ferrum for making the sig pic! He's beast af people.
IGN: BestJanusNA
What I'm listening to right now: Derp -Bassjackers

dacoqrs


Prominent (40)
Posts: 807
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by OGBlackPanther » July 22, 2014 6:24am | Report

Raventhor, we have to face facts. Not everyone is going to be in position all the time during a solo queue or any match for that position. Everyone gets out of position sometime and that's a sad fact. Loki's stealth allows him to get through people being in even remotely good position. The squishy targets stay at the back and every assassin has a tool that lets them get to the back relatively safely. The problem with loki's is, it's undetectable unless he's in the immediate vicinity when he goes into stealth. He's undetectable by wards, and within an instant can be on you and 100-0 you with no problems at all. That's where all the problem is arising, you have no time to counter him within that time. You can get beads, you can get aegis, but you're using active slots and those have cd's that are longer than a full cdr (which is pretty much his only kit) loki. Like others have said, the damage numbers between Loki and an ADC are pretty much the same. Here's the thing though, most ADC's wont be 100-0'ing you before you know it. Loki does that in an instant, pops his stealth, get out, rinse, repeat. And that's where my problem with him arises. I've seen how loki works and his mechanics imo is pretty broken. I understand that he's bursty and needs to have that damage potential but it's ridiculous that it carries through most stages of the game. Loki doesn't really have a teamfight. All the other assassins apart from maybe thanatos do. All the other assassins don't have the presence Loki has though. Loki can make a team fight off of initiating and 100-0ing a squishy. Loki can get out pretty safely once he gets in (a common case in casuals and even arena) and not to mention as many have seen before, if you're getting away and he gets that decoy off to bodyblock you, you're dead. Smite made Loki hard to particularly focus. You can't focus someone who can go invisible and get out before you even know it. And to be frank, it's not practical for a whole team to be keeping their eyes out for one loki just make sure he doesn't get to their squishies which, as I've said, his kit allows him to get in there easy. My problem with Loki is this. He has high damage, and he's relatively untouchable. The only way to get through stealth is dots. But dots aren't present on every god and not all dots are all that great. Not to mention if Loki gets dotted, he can just get out quick and be right back on you from a different approach. Don't get me wrong, Loki's a rewarding god, and his burst is his "niche" but his burst is kind of ridiculous. He's like a melee He Bo in his own regard. Loki's not a hard god to master. At least, from what I've seen of him he doesn't have anything that's remotely difficult about him to get his damage off. His ult has a stun, preventing any cc and if you somehow manage to beads it early, you're not skillful, you're lucky. And even then he'll be right back before your beads are off cd. I wouldn't have a problem with him if he wasn't pretty average in difficulty. Here you have gods like Janus, high burst but his damage isn't guaranteed damage. If you hit his ult, best feeling in the world. Hell, even his two has somewhat the same value (although it has been made easier to hit it). People are pretty much fine with him, he's squishy AND he has good teamfight potential. Why not give Loki the same treatment. Make his damage not so guaranteed for the little bit of skill it takes to land his ult and the successive abilities soon after. I mean come on, his ult has a radius, which is fair but considering the game is skill shot oriented, any player that's average at skill shots will be hitting them on a regular basis. And any competent smite player will be hitting their skill shots. Going back to my Janus example, think of when he first came out. He had to WORK just to clear his wave and he had to put even more work into his ult. Of course, that's not really the case now, but it still stands, his damage can not be guaranteed. He's no Ao Kuang where you just put down a tornado and do damage or hit a squall and then follow up with a tornado and bam, you've got damage on them but the point is there. Make Loki REALLY have to work for his damage, not just do things that are expected of smite players on a general. If you don't make him work for the damage, then nerf it and give him something else. Give him a team fight. Give him a temporary stealth on his allies. Most assassins don't 100-0 people. Fenrir doesn't, Arachne doesn't, Merc, Bastet, Baka whoever. Assassins aren't there to be overpowered damage, they are there to help the team.
OGBlackPanther



Posts: 11
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by All4Games » July 22, 2014 6:45am | Report
@OGblackpanther

One word. Paragraphs.

It would help a lot if you spaced parts of your comment out so people can read it better.
never forget dawngate and never forgive EA. Freia will hunt them for eternity.
All4Games


Distinguished (54)
Posts: 2513
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Subzero008 » July 22, 2014 6:46am | Report
Raventhor wrote:

That's why positioning matters in this game. Everyone can oneshot you very easily without positioning (see release-date Chang'E for the most mindless instagib ever)

People look at numbers too much and not practicality/positioning.

Actually, no. That's just the thing: A fed Loki literally oneshots you, while others figuratively oneshot you. Positioning is a lot more difficult when, as I stressed before, the enemy deals a lot of INSTANT damage.

It isn't like Mercury jumping on you, or Fenrir stunning you, or seeing Thanatos in the air. You may be able to tell he's coming, but there's no preliminary step before the damage. And his damage is fast - Bastet has to cast a few times, Merc is close but the delay on his dash is fairly significant, Arachne is close but has no mobility, Nemesis' actually isn't even that fast, etc.

Like, if you see a fed Bastet, you can put yourself behind a tank. If you see a fed Loki, you pretty much have to run to a tower, which he could sadly combat blink out of. It's difficult to focus fire a Loki when he is fed enough to the point where he can delete one of his potential attackers.
Subzero008


Renowned (112)
Posts: 4262
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Subzero008 » July 22, 2014 6:54am | Report
dacoqrs wrote:

The problem really is, if you touch his damage, he'll become useless. Because if you don't kill someone right away, you'll get cced and die everytime.

I don't know how I feel about Loki. At some point, yes his damage is certainly incredible, but he has SO many downsides... no teamfight presence, squishy, terrible when focused.

I think Loki is fine the way he is. Because when someone is a bad Loki, they don't do well (I've seen it before, especially in Arena) and when someone is a good Loki, they're hard to beat! Isn't that how a balanced god should work?

No, that is not how it should work. A good Loki is awful against a good team but is excellent against a bad one by how quickly he snowballs. Heck, a bad Loki is good against a bad team, because of how uncounterable his damage is - it depends on team cohesion more than individual skill, because in the case of individuals, Loki is practically uncounterable. (His niche in Joust, for example).

A god who is equally useful regardless of skill is not balanced. In any way.
Subzero008


Renowned (112)
Posts: 4262
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Subzero008 » July 22, 2014 6:55am | Report
Devampi wrote:

I got some sort of fix for the stealth. give sentry wards and tower true sight (like in dota) then invis would be revealed until they walk out of the sight range.

Towers already have it, wards don't. The reason why they don't give it to wards is because of all those gods uber reliant on stealth instead of a proper gap closer. Basically, they suck so hard that HiRez won't give a counter to stealth or they'll be completely ruined.
Subzero008


Renowned (112)
Posts: 4262
View My Blog
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Subzero008 » July 22, 2014 6:57am | Report
OGBlackPanther wrote:

Raventhor, we have to face facts. Not everyone is going to be in position all the time during a solo queue or any match for that position. Everyone gets out of position sometime and that's a sad fact. Loki's stealth allows him to get through people being in even remotely good position. The squishy targets stay at the back and every assassin has a tool that lets them get to the back relatively safely. The problem with loki's is, it's undetectable unless he's in the immediate vicinity when he goes into stealth. He's undetectable by wards, and within an instant can be on you and 100-0 you with no problems at all. That's where all the problem is arising, you have no time to counter him within that time. You can get beads, you can get aegis, but you're using active slots and those have cd's that are longer than a full cdr (which is pretty much his only kit) loki. Like others have said, the damage numbers between Loki and an ADC are pretty much the same. Here's the thing though, most ADC's wont be 100-0'ing you before you know it. Loki does that in an instant, pops his stealth, get out, rinse, repeat. And that's where my problem with him arises. I've seen how loki works and his mechanics imo is pretty broken. I understand that he's bursty and needs to have that damage potential but it's ridiculous that it carries through most stages of the game. Loki doesn't really have a teamfight. All the other assassins apart from maybe thanatos do. All the other assassins don't have the presence Loki has though. Loki can make a team fight off of initiating and 100-0ing a squishy. Loki can get out pretty safely once he gets in (a common case in casuals and even arena) and not to mention as many have seen before, if you're getting away and he gets that decoy off to bodyblock you, you're dead. Smite made Loki hard to particularly focus. You can't focus someone who can go invisible and get out before you even know it. And to be frank, it's not practical for a whole team to be keeping their eyes out for one loki just make sure he doesn't get to their squishies which, as I've said, his kit allows him to get in there easy. My problem with Loki is this. He has high damage, and he's relatively untouchable. The only way to get through stealth is dots. But dots aren't present on every god and not all dots are all that great. Not to mention if Loki gets dotted, he can just get out quick and be right back on you from a different approach. Don't get me wrong, Loki's a rewarding god, and his burst is his "niche" but his burst is kind of ridiculous. He's like a melee He Bo in his own regard. Loki's not a hard god to master. At least, from what I've seen of him he doesn't have anything that's remotely difficult about him to get his damage off. His ult has a stun, preventing any cc and if you somehow manage to beads it early, you're not skillful, you're lucky. And even then he'll be right back before your beads are off cd. I wouldn't have a problem with him if he wasn't pretty average in difficulty. Here you have gods like Janus, high burst but his damage isn't guaranteed damage. If you hit his ult, best feeling in the world. Hell, even his two has somewhat the same value (although it has been made easier to hit it). People are pretty much fine with him, he's squishy AND he has good teamfight potential. Why not give Loki the same treatment. Make his damage not so guaranteed for the little bit of skill it takes to land his ult and the successive abilities soon after. I mean come on, his ult has a radius, which is fair but considering the game is skill shot oriented, any player that's average at skill shots will be hitting them on a regular basis. And any competent smite player will be hitting their skill shots. Going back to my Janus example, think of when he first came out. He had to WORK just to clear his wave and he had to put even more work into his ult. Of course, that's not really the case now, but it still stands, his damage can not be guaranteed. He's no Ao Kuang where you just put down a tornado and do damage or hit a squall and then follow up with a tornado and bam, you've got damage on them but the point is there. Make Loki REALLY have to work for his damage, not just do things that are expected of smite players on a general. If you don't make him work for the damage, then nerf it and give him something else. Give him a team fight. Give him a temporary stealth on his allies. Most assassins don't 100-0 people. Fenrir doesn't, Arachne doesn't, Merc, Bastet, Baka whoever. Assassins aren't there to be overpowered damage, they are there to help the team.

OH MY GOD MY EYES

Um, I agree with this, I think? His damage is too uncounterable for the damage it deals; reduce either the uncounterability or the damage or both.
Subzero008


Renowned (112)
Posts: 4262
View My Blog
<< 1 3 5 6 7 8 9 10 13 16 >>
Forum

SmiteFire & Smite

Smite is an online battleground between mythical gods. Players choose from a selection of gods, join session-based arena combat and use custom powers and team tactics against other players and minions. Smite is inspired by Defense of the Ancients (DotA) but instead of being above the action, the third-person camera brings you right into the combat. And, instead of clicking a map, you use WASD to move, dodge, and fight your way through the detailed graphics of SMITE's battlegrounds.

Smite Gods

Arachne Awilix Bakasura Bastet Camazotz Cliodhna Da Ji Fenrir Hun Batz Kali Lancelot Loki Mercury Ne Zha Nemesis Pele Ratatoskr Ravana Serqet Set Susano Thanatos Thor Tsukuyomi
Ares Artio Athena Atlas Bacchus Bake Kujira Cabrakan Cerberus Charon Cthulhu Fafnir Ganesha Geb Jormungandr Khepri Kumbhakarna Kuzenbo Maui Sobek Sylvanus Terra Xing Tian Yemoja Ymir
Ah Muzen Cab Anhur Apollo Artemis Cernunnos Charybdis Chernobog Chiron Cupid Danzaburou Hachiman Heimdallr Hou Yi Ishtar Izanami Jing Wei Martichoras Medusa Neith Nut Rama Skadi Ullr Xbalanque
Achilles Amaterasu Bellona Chaac Cu Chulainn Erlang Shen Gilgamesh Guan Yu Hercules Horus King Arthur Mulan Nike Odin Osiris Shiva Sun Wukong Surtr Tyr Vamana
Agni Ah Puch Anubis Ao Kuang Aphrodite Baba Yaga Baron Samedi Chang'e Chronos Discordia Eset Freya Hades He Bo Hel Hera Ix Chel Janus Kukulkan Maman Brigitte Merlin Morgan Le Fay Nox Nu Wa Olorun Persephone Poseidon Ra Raijin Scylla Sol The Morrigan Thoth Tiamat Vulcan Yu Huang Zeus Zhong Kui
View All Gods

SMITEFire is the place to find the perfect build guide to take your game to the next level. Learn how to play a new god, or fine tune your favorite SMITE gods’s build and strategy.

Copyright © 2019 SMITEFire | All Rights Reserved

} } } } }