Daily Reworks Thread

For the Nem rework, isn't her dash basically Dart?

They're actually fairly different, even ignoring the acorn gimmick.

A reset cooldown lets you have a lot more freedom. Imagine how much better Ares would be if his Chains let you cast them up to 10 seconds after hitting with one, rather than 2 seconds. Similarly, Nemesis can be stalled until her recast in unavailable.

Dart also has a higher cooldown - 14 seconds, and can work potentially up to five times. Nem's dash has a 6 sec CD at max rank but lets her recast only once. Which would give Dart overall far more mobility in both burstiness and sustained-ness, because, seriously, a cooldown reset? -_-

They're still too similar for my tastes, but I'm not sure what to do. Adding strength into the dash might push it into Smite territory. If you're wondering, the original version of the ult reduced the first enemy's physical protections to 0 for a few seconds.

If you want to talk about similar abilities, how about Night Crawler versus Through the Cosmos? They play virtually identically.

Lol that's because HiRez has little to no creativity. "Oh, but it's branches, guys! Not a web! Totally different! And he has to jump!" -_-

Idk, you seem much better at kit design than I am, so I will defer to you. Just pointing out a slight similarity.

Scylla Rework.

Why?

1: Scylla is a horrible mishmash of awful design. Her ult is pretty much Kuang's ult with a recast/move speed attached. Her 1 and 2 are pretty much ripped straight out of Lux's kit, and her Sentinel makes no sense on a supposed mage carry.

2: Passive is dumb. Seriously, it's dumb. Not only is it yet another rip-off of League, but it's 100% uninteractive. It would be more interesting if there was any kind of choice involved in leveling her abilities, but there isn't.

3: Her kit is...not weird. Like, she's a giant tentacle monster but only uses those tentacles for 2 attacks. She's a cute thing tied to a monster, and her attacks are just generic balls and beams of green energy. Like, what.

4: Her general idea goes have counterplay. That's like the one single good thing. Oh, wait, that's because her main damage skills were ripped from League.

Goals: Add creativity and give a more monster-like feel.


Passive: Sadism: Scylla delights in her enemies' suffering, reducing her cooldowns by 1 second whenever she successfully damages an enemy with an ability, halved for nongods.

Accuracy rewarded.


Q: Pursuit: Scylla sends one of her hounds toward target enemy, who rush forward and bite the first target in their path (they're kind of stupid, really), dealing 60/90/120/150/180 damage (+45% of your magical power) and slowing the enemy hit by 20/25/30/35/40% for 2 seconds. Hitting the same target twice roots and cripples them for 1 second plus the duration of the remaining slow. This ability has two charges and a 1 second cooldown in-between. Cooldown: 13 seconds.

This ability has a fairly long cooldown, but it's a versatile tool that lets you proc your passive, slow down multiple pursuers, deals a decent chunk of damage with only one hit, and has a very strong cripple/root + nuke, albeit being single target and reliant on hitting with a skillshot, twice - something far more difficult with minions and teammates nearby.


W: Chomp: Scylla burrows one of her tentacles through the ground, rooting herself for 0.75 seconds. A moment later, one of her pets' gaping jaws rise out of the earth to devour all enemies in target 15-foot radius circle, dealing 90/140/190/240/290 damage (+80% of your magical power) and knocking them up for 0.75 seconds. Cooldown: 15/14/13/12/11 seconds.

Long range nuke that also has CC. It also makes you vulnerable and has a delay. Obvious synergy with her Q, but has counterplay.


E: Sentinel: Scylla plants one of her familiars at a nearby target location for 8/10/12/14/16 seconds. The hound grants vision within a 20 foot radius (bad eyes is the only way I can justify the Q), and attempts to bite the closest enemy within 15 feet, dealing 90/125/160/195/230 damage (+60% of your magical power) and slowing (25%) and revealing the target for 3 seconds. Scylla can command the familiar to return before it attacks, refunding half the ability's cooldown. Cooldown: 20 seconds.

Zoning tool and impromptu ward. It can be used as a nuke, I suppose. However, it has a few problems with that: It's closer ranged than a burst mage would prefer, has an opportunity cost as a security option, has a massive cooldown if it does attack, doesn't distinguish between one enemy and the next, and depending on how you hit with your Pursuits, might mess up your combo since this ability also has a delay. But it's still a viable option, albeit with some consequences.


R: Rampage: Scylla transforms into a giant monster, granting herself 30/45/60/75/90 protections, 200/250/300/350/400 bonus health (+50% of your magical power) for 7 seconds. In addition, her R becomes Crush for the duration, Pursuit now passes through minions and travels 5/10/15/20/25 feet further, and Chomp's radius is increased to 18 feet.

Cooldown: 120/115/110/105/100 seconds.

R: Crush: Slam a tentacle onto target 10-foot radius circle after a 0.5 second delay, dealing 90/120/150/180/210 damage (+50% of your magical power). Static Cooldown: 1 second. Has no mana cost. Using Crush will not interrupt or interfere with any of Scylla's other orders, meaning that you can still cast it in the mini-channels of your other abilities seamlessly.

This is Scylla's Kaiju ultimate. You basically become Godzilla for 7 seconds. You literally don't even have to basic attack anymore, as you get a free spell every second. And this new spell is also a handy way to utilize your passive. For a few seconds, you become a complete monster.

(To Clarify, for the duration of Rampage, your ultimate becomes another ability, and it has a static cooldown, meaning its cooldown will never change from CDR or your own passive. Because having a 0 second cooldown damage nuke would be insane.)

However, you do still have the delays on your basic abilities and even your new R. You might get a massive amount of health and protections, but enemies can still CC you and run away from you. And lastly, this doesn't really patch up (normal) Scylla's biggest weakness: Mobility. You can still be focused down and killed, and even if nothing can match your sheer damage output while transformed, and enemies might even simply run away from you. You still have all the weaknesses of the original Scylla, amplified by your larger hitbox, which is the biggest (literally) drawback: it is a lot easier to hit you.


Scylla is a heavily skillshot-dependent burst mage that has completely unmatched damage potential. She lacks mobility of any sort and relies on careful positioning and combos to maximize damage output and minimize retaliation. However, her ultimate amplifies her strengths while removing the pesky "burst" aspect of her kit, letting her repeatedly reset her cooldowns while gaining significant tankiness for a few seconds.

Strengths: That damage. Hit a Pursuit, knock them up, hit another pursuit, then sentinel. All while pounding them with Crush, if available. Then Pursuit chain them again. CC isn't bad, either.

Weaknesses: Raw pushing does counter her, and her lack of mobility makes ganking a problem, even with her free ward. Her ultimate's cooldown is pretty big, and being bigger also makes her easy to focus down and kill, as 90 protections and around 700 health doesn't quite make up for the ****py base stats.

It's fun for everyone, really. It's fun to be the monster, but at the same time, imagine the rush you get after bringing down an enemy Scylla when transformed. Or Scylla vs Scylla.

So...broken?

Physical power items are bad for two reasons: Too efficient items hurts counterbuilding (its so much more efficient to build power/pen than protections, which is so bad that teams can have three ****ing ADCs and have no problems), and there isn't a ton of choice because so much items suck ***.

Problems List: Heartseeker dominates, Devo Gloves are boring as ****, Bloodforge is an altered clone of DG, Soul Eater is useless, Ancile is boring, Frostbound Hammer is ********, Hydra's Lament is worthless, Qin's Sais are ruined, Malice is redundant, Rage is boring, The Executioner is too good, Shifter's Shield is NU, Void Shield could be better and Transcendence is worthless with Bluestone.


Heartseeker: 1550 cost, 10 physical power. You gain 5 physical power per stack and gain 2 stacks per god kill and 1 per assist. You automatically gain five stacks when first purchased, to a maximum of 20 stacks, losing half upon death. At max stacks, you gain 20% move speed and attack speed.

There is something seriously ****ing wrong with the game if it's the meta to build what should be a SNOWBALL item on the CARRY.

The whole "stacking with minions" idea needs to die. Not only because farming mindlessly is boring, but because encouraging mindless farming is a bad idea anyhow. At least this way, you have to have some element of risk vs reward with this item, rather than "guarenteed reward, then risk" that makes this item contribute to both the snowball problem and the ADC itemization problem.

But I honestly think that all of these "snowball items" should literally just be removed from the game. Dawngate had that. So here's an alternative version that I prefer.

Heartseeker: 2400 cost, 35 physical power, 6% move speed, 10 physical penetration. Passive: Reaper: You gain 15% move speed when moving toward a visible target below 25% health. Killing a god gives you 30% move speed for 5 seconds.

New Niche: Assassins. And maybe some carries, or warriors that are good at executing enemies. It's not a must buy, though.


Soul Eater: 2850 cost, 15% lifesteal, 500 health, 25 physical power. Passive: Soul Eater: You deal 2% of the target's maximum health as magic damage with each basic attack and ability hit, and you are healed for 100% of the damage dealt. This effect has a 0.5 second cooldown.

It's a combination of early tankiness, tank-busting power, and plain ol' lifesteal.


Bloodforge: 2600 cost, 40 physical power, 20 physical protection, 10% lifesteal. Passive: Blood Drain: Your abilities heal you for 25% of the damage dealt, halved for AoE attacks.

Obligatory physical caster based lifesteal. However, this item is also good because of its relative cheapness.


Devourer's Gloves: 3000 cost, 35 physical power, 10% lifesteal. Passive: Rising Hunger: You gain 6 physical power and 3% lifesteal for 4 seconds with each successful basic attack, stacking up to five times, up to a total of 65 physical power and 25% lifesteal.

Upside: This item makes some ADCs great with sustained damage. Downsides: Cost and stack-up. 35 physical power and 10% lifesteal isn't impressive for an item that has such a massive price, so there is going to be some kind of decision-making here.


Ancile: 75 magical protection, 10% CDR, 200 health, 2750 cost. Passive: Absorbtion: Your cooldowns are reduced by 1 second whenever you take ability damage. This effect can only activate once a second. (Use for support tanks against wide AoE damage or for bruisers against mages.)

Because items that mix power and tankiness make good itemization difficult. Sounds counter-intuitive, since making an item more versatile = good, right? Problem is that it makes warriors extremely efficient with these sort of items, letting them ramp up both power and protections without sacrificing one or the other. Too efficient = everyone buys it because it's too good (like the old focused void blade/stone), or not efficient enough = garbage or warriors only. This way, it's an option for both tanks and bruisers without choking out other items. /lecture


Frostbound Hammer: 2950 cost, 500 health, 30 physical power. Passive: Frost: Dealing damage decreases move speed for 1 second; 20% for ranged autos, 35% for melee autos, 30% for single-target abilities and 15% for AoE abilities.

It's more useful and versatile, but actually requires skill and consistency to use, and isn't a "early game of death" item.


Hydra's Lament: 3000 cost, 6% move speed, 15% attack speed, 5% CDR, 30 physical power. Passive: Maul: After using an ability, your next basic attack in 6 seconds deals 50 + 120% of your basic attack damage as bonus physical damage. This effect has a 3 second cooldown.

This item sounds ridiculous, and it kind of is, but Loki deals a ridiculous amount of burst already that needs to be toned down. This item is heavily dependent on the champion that uses it, but don't forget that it doesn't offer much power on its own, has a 3 sec cooldown, and costs 3000 gold to build, making it a waste of time if you're building crits.


Qin's Sais: 3000 cost, 25 physical power, 25% attack speed, 3% move speed. Passive: Giant Killer: Your basic attacks deal 20 + 2% of the target's max health and 8% of the target's bonus health as bonus physical damage.

Niche of tank-busting instead of pure health damage.


Brawler's Beat Stick: 2400 cost, 35 physical power, 20% crit chance. Passive: Mortal Strike: Dealing damage reduces healing, lifesteal, and shielding by 50% for 3 seconds.

Because more viable crit items + healing reduction = good thing. Weakness of this item is how it's inferior to other crit/power items when not against healers, or if the healing matters little.


Malice: 40 physical power, 400 health, 15% attack speed. 3000 cost. Passive: Hateful Blows: You deal 10% more damage to enemies who have damaged you in the past 3 seconds.

Useful for all sorts of things, but not terribly good for initiators, making it paradoxically bad for assassins.


Transcendence: 25 physical power, 300 health, 15 move speed, 10% crit chance, 5% CDR, 3000 cost. Passive: Enlightenment: Using an ability grants you 15% bonus crit chance, 10% move speed, and 15 physical power for 3 seconds. This effect has a cooldown of 2.5 seconds.

Some bruisers would just love this. Not great for ADCs who don't like only 25 physical power and 300 health, but useful for crit bruisers or some ADCs who can repeatedly proc its effect.


Ichaival: WHO MADE THIS ITEM? WHO THE **** MAKES 30 PHYSICAL POWER AND 30% ATTACK SPEED AND 10 PEN AND AD STEAL FOR ****ING 1700 GOLD? HOW THE **** WAS THIS A GOOD IDEA?

Or let me put it another way. Ichaival, with its effects proportionally stretched to 3000 gold, would have roughly 53.1 physical power, 53.1 attack speed, and 17.8 pen, plus 30 power steal. Tell me, does over 50 physical power AND attack speed on a single item, plus 17 pen, sound balanced in any way, shape, or form? That's not even including the power steal!

NEW STATS: Cost: 3000 gold. 40% attack speed, 15 move speed, 5% CDR. Passive: Eagle Eye: Your basic attacks gain 20% range.

It's stats frankly suck for the cost. This item is extremely passive-oriented. Is it good? It depends on many factors; playstyles, where you fight, what gamemode, what both teams are like, etc. It's completely worthless for melee characters, who would get around 2.5 feet of range, which is hardly worth the price.


Odysseus' Bow: 3250 cost, 25% crit chance, 25% attack speed, 20 move speed. Passive: Ricochet: Your basic attacks bounce a random target within 20 feet, dealing 50% of the damage dealt to the primary target to the second target as magical damage.

Is this item balanced? Isn't it too luck-based? Well, this item's basically a single target Golden Bow with decent stats and making mixed damage, so I think it's actually quite sensible.


Rage: 30% attack speed, 15 physical power, 15 physical penetration, 3000 cost. Passive: Sharpened Edge: 15% of your unmodified basic attack damage is dealt as additional true damage.

A waste of an item against all-squish teams, but excellent against armor-stackers or gods with damage reduction. It doesn't work with crits, because that would make this item pretty crazy on ADCs.


The Executioner: 2700 cost, 35 physical power, 250 health, 15 penetration. Passive: Sunder: Dealing damage reduces protections by 5%, depending on the type of damage dealt, for 4 seconds, stacking up to four times.

Takes longer to ramp up, is less efficient at shredding protections, but it gets a bit more utility by working with magic damage.


Shifter's Shield: 3000 cost, 75 physical protections, 25 magical protections. Passive: Adaptation: You have five stacks of Adaptation. Taking physical damage removes a stack, taking magic damage adds one, up to ten stacks max, resetting to five when out of combat. Every stack of Adaptation reduces your physical protections by 5 and increases your magical protections by 5.

So basically, you have 50 physical and magical protection, and taking damage raises the protections of whatever type of damage you take, while decreasing the other one. It's obviously good for duelists, but also against rapid tick damage, which makes this respond extremely quickly.


Void Shield: 2700 cost, 25 physical power, 35 physical protections, 200 health. Passive: Void Aura: Dealing damage steals physical protections by 4, stacking up to five times, for four seconds.

This effect scales naturally with the game. Useful for those with AoE stuff, synergizing naturally with the typical warrior playstyle.

Sub I have had my doubts... But this is all very well thought out and amazing, I love the idea of drawing off other thing than power for extra damage. My only question is why aren't you on they balance team man? This **** is genius... Like I would petition to get you on balance team to bring in a fresh start too items for season 3.

He's not on the design team because working with the men and women who made this game state possible would disgust him.

Seriously though, I respect this. I've gotten used to playing the fast-paced game that is current Smite, with low prices, and I've never played League, but I would play a game that had items akin to these. Nicely done, Sub.

You're too kind.

Typing on my phone here, so I'll be brief.

Gen Rework to increase counterplay - general concepts only.

Ult changes from AoE stun to AoE slow. A slowing AoE that repeats every 1.5 seconds.

Shield no longer cleanses but makes you CC immune while active. Careful timing is needed, less oppressive against enemy laners. Oppressive is an important word here. Enemy has more options = fun??!

Alternatively, make it a big shield based on Gebs health or physical protections, but it makes the hitbox bigger. Like, your shielding someone by putting an upside down bowl of earth on them.
But do nothing else.

OR, make the shield increase hitbox, and when it breaks, any CC affecting target is removed, like a lizard. A monster bites a lizards tail, and when the tail is chopped off, the lizard runs for it with less limbs to bite. You're basically pinning tails onto allies.

Oh...and passive: Primordial Earth: Gebs hitbox is 25% larger. Gebs base stats are slightly better. Geb ignores 0.3 seconds of CC + 0.1 per rank 3 item, so a 2 sex stun would become a 1,1 sec stun with a full build. He's a giant clod of earth supposed to BE the earth and his hotbox is the same size as Ratoskr's, WTF...

Sleep for week

Oh, auto-correct. You never sees to make me laugh!

Sylvanus Rework.


Passive: Verdant Growth: Sylvanus regenerates 1.5% of his maximum health every second when not damaged in the last 5 seconds.


Q: Seed Bomb: Sylvanus throws a seed at target location. The seed can be detonated instantly to deal 70/105/140/175/210 magic damage (+40% of your magical power) in a 15-foot radius, slowing enemies hit by 20% for 3 seconds. 4 seconds later, the seed will plant itself, and detonating will deal 1.5x damage and slow enemies for 40%. Waiting a total of 8 seconds will make the seed sprout, and detonating will deal doubled damage and slow enemies by 60% for 3 seconds. This ability holds up to two charges.

Cooldown: 10 seconds.

Seed Health: 80 + 20 per level
Protections: 20 + 5 per level

Versatile zoning tool, immediate CC, and bodyblocking tool. Leveling it up first will give you the most damage, as its health and CC don't scale with level. You can put one on top of the other to instantly deal double damage, but the slow doesn't stack and its radius is short enough so that most can just walk away, unless you root them first.

It is possible to go full mage Sylvanus, which would be pretty amusing.


W: Nature's Gift: Sylvanus blesses a target allied god, healing them for 55/90/125/160/195 health (+25% of your magical power) and 8/10/12/14/16% of your current health. This ability can be used on a Seed Bomb to instantly detonate it, resetting this ability's cooldown and refunding 100% of its mana.

Cooldown: 8 seconds.

No more stupid, overpowered, brainless, no-counterplay Wisps. This heal may not look like much, but when you account for cooldown reduction and a tank's level of health, it's actually extremely strong. However, note that the heal gets weaker as Sylvanus does. And your heal, while strong, must be used carefully, as it is your best tool for detonating seeds.


E: Nature's Grasp: Sylvanus sprouts entangling vines from the earth, rooting and crippling enemies in a 12-foot radius circle for 1.3/1.6/1.9/2.2/2.5 seconds after a short delay and dealing 80/120/160/200/240 damage (+50% of your magical power). Cooldown: 18/17/16/15/14 seconds.

It's an AoE root that lasts a pretty long time. It does have a high cooldown, but at max rank, your team could report you for being AFK. You can definitely juke it, though, so it's best used when you can lead the opponent, leaning it slightly toward defensive use.


R: Wrath of Terra: Sylvanus' Treant launches its hand forward 70 feet, dealing 100/150/200/250/300 damage (+300% of your basic attack damage) pulling the first target, stunning them for 0.5 seconds. Cooldown: 30/28/26/24/22 seconds.

Arachne's old ultimate, with cooldown reduction and slightly more damage. You can set up seeds and pull them toward it, or simply pull enemies out of position into death. Or pull them away from seeds. Or whatever. It's pretty useful.


Strengths: Great self and ally-sustain, multiple zoning tools and tricky, complex gameplay that lets you approach from multiple angles. Long CC. Your passive lets you recover quickly from a skirmish.

Weaknesses/Counters: Only true hard CC is a 0.5 second stun that is blocked by everything. Seeds are unreliable without your heal up and can be destroyed by abilities. Zero mobility and not much offensive pressure - your lack of mobility and piercing makes utilizing your ultimate in the way you want it fairly difficult. And being damaged limits your heals.

Playstyle: Defense. Healing is healing, and your root can be used both offensively and defensively, making it your second-best offensive option. Your ultimate lets you pick off enemies or ensnare retreating ones, and your seeds are incredibly zoning tools with coordination.