Build Guide PSA :: SmiteFire

Forum » General Discussion » Build Guide PSA 14 posts - page 1 of 2

There is a "meta" build for a reason. Anything that deviates from the standard meta build needs to be explained.

I'm all for breaking the meta - played Dawngate and did some weird jungle stuff in the past. But the meta is the meta for a reason.

Many build guides, instead of explaining why the build should be played, merely elect to say the general strong points of their particular build, while glossing over the low points, or a general statement on how the thing is supposed to go.

But this is not what they should be doing. Don't tell us that your lifestealess ADC build has (pro) high damage and (con) no healing. Don't tell us that your bootless, lifesteal-crit Thor is (pro) sustain and dueling strength, and (con) squishy and bad in groups. Telling the obvious is pointless and a waste of time, and we can see it for ourselves.

Instead, tell us WHY getting no lifesteal is worth it, and why we should use it over the standard ADC build. Or something else. Just. Explain. Why.

Here's an example. .

Hypothesis: A Thanatos building tank is significantly more effective than the standard, traditional assassin build (crits/lifesteal/attack speed/pen).

Build: You build , then , using the early-mid game as cover for building damage. After that, you go pure tank. , , , whatever fits the situation.*

Why?

1. High base damages and low scalings. His Q has only 60% scalings, his W has 60%, and his R does either pathetic damage no matter what you build, or instantly executes the enemy. Even when building full damage, your abilities still hit practically the same. And I've played a lot of Thanatos, so I'd know.

2. You are unsuited for basic attacks. You don't have an AA steroid, your base attack speed is among the worst of all assassins, and all of your main damaging abilities have significantly longer range than your basic attacks, creating a large gap between your main kit and your autoattacks. And crossing this gap is losing the one advantage you have over most assassins. It just makes sense.

3. It patches up the core problems with his kit. Unlike Serqet, Batz, or Thor, Thanatos doesn't have the raw CC and mobility to survive a melee engagement - the only logical conclusion, if you can't dodge or preemptively counter, is to block. The inherent healing in his kit suits this purpose, in theory, but...

4. Healing. Healing 10% of your health back, or 200 health, is only "okay" for a squishy assassin, but great for a tank. A well-executed Thanatos, with this build, can survive a surprising amount of damage that would fell any other assassin.

5. There's less need for damage. The loss of damage means less as the game goes on, as Thanatos doesn't have the 100-0 someone. Due to his ultimate, it's 100-24, then 100-28, and then 100-32, and so on. This puts less pressure on Thanatos to deal damage, as he simply has to deal less in order to kill people.

Playstyle: To be clear, you are not a support. You are a tank-assassin. Your primary goal is to still deal damage and kill people - you're just wearing more armor when you're doing it.

Cons: Slightly less damage than usual. Hits significantly weaker at melee range.*
Pros: Far more resilience, better kit synergy and safety when going "all-in" into towers and teams.
Neutral: Dueling potential is untouched, or could even be better.

THIS is how you make a "build guide."

By the way, this also applies to all other guides who provide more than one build. Don't say "meta build" and then "my favorite build" and then "CDR build." People aren't looking for sentimentality, but effectiveness, and providing builds that you don't even use 90% of the time is a waste of time and effort, on your end and theirs.

*You won't hit like a wet noodle, but you won't be critting into the seven hundreds, either.

Renowned (112)
Posts: 4262
View My Blog

Hasn't building like a tank as how you've described always been more of the meta way regardless?

But yeah, good points were made here. Generally I use meta builds in my guides, but otherwise it's definitely good to explain your reasoning behind your build. TBH I could probably do that more so in some of my older guides.

Smite Account: Zilby__________Steam Account: Zilby
Blizzard: Zilby#11991_________Twitch: TheZilb

I am the most foul, cruel and bad tempered rodent you've ever set eyes upon!.. Oh, her? Yes, well... she's with me.

Feel free to PM me with any questions or comments. I can offer feedback on gameplay and BBcoding tips, as well as moderation help if needed.

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Renowned (132)
Posts: 2074
View My Blog

wrote:

I have literally never seen a single Thanatos in ranked that hasn't been me. Nor in CQ, or arena, or any other game mode. He seems to have just dropped off the face of the earth - I've seen Anubis more than I've seen him.

Besides, Tiermonster told me that the most common build in League is Tabi-Jotunn's-Magi-Hydra-Shifter's-Titan's. This pretty much only shares the first two items - Magi's is generally too squishy to be tanky, and Shifter's is mainly a damage item.

Renowned (112)
Posts: 4262
View My Blog

That Tiermonster build is sort of a hybrid, it's meant to allow to drop in on squishies late game, take them out with his base damages, the proc from and the pen from . Afterwards he can then escape while being CC immune from magi's blessing and somewhat protected by . is the most flexible item for the hybrid build, but it's purpose is just to add some tankiness since magi's blessing mostly adds health. I've also seen people swap out for to accomplish much the same thing as while maintaining 40% CDR and an open item slot.

Generally though I'd recommend magi's blessing on any non-tanky since he's really easy to lock down with CC and just alone has a long cooldown.

But yeah, there's basically three options for :

Crit/AA build - Good if you get super fed and are pubstomping people, not much good for anything else since the slightest bit of CC or focus will destroy you.

Hybrid/Ability Build - The one from Tiermonster, still on the squishy side but allows you to divebomb squishies on the back line and take them out rather effectively while still being hard to lock down. Focuses more on cooldowns, penetration and the proc from for damage due to ' low ability scalings.

Tank Build - The build you described. Allows greater presence in teamfights and for dueling opponents, but is somewhat less effective at singling out squishy gods due to lower penetration and the proc from . Can be better or worse than the hybrid build depending on your and the other team's composition.

Idk why you never see though, he's a pretty common pick in casual cq and other gametypes. I'm not sure if he's that present in ranked though.

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Renowned (132)
Posts: 2074
View My Blog

The problem with the hybrid build is that:

Magi's Blessing is just not effective as a tanky item. It's more utility-oriented, as its tank stats are just too lackluster for a true tank - plus, the utility bit itself got nerfed. Shifter's Shield is the same. Spirit Robe is good, but that's just one item.

(There's also the issue of many "Bruiser" items being inefficient. Void Shield is weak, is slot-inefficient and its passive is almost useless (situational +75 base physical damage is terrible*, needs to stack up, etc.)

So in the end, it's similar to building pure power, with only 30-60 bonus protections at most, and 350 bonus health (or no bonus health, depending).

The tank build is difficult to quantify, but assuming you go fully balanced to match the hybrid build (Hide, Spirit Robe, Bulwark and Hammer), that's 160 protections each and 1050 bonus health.

Calculations:

Hybrid: 1890 + 350 = 2240 health, with 109 protections (69 armor at level 20 + 40).

1000 base physical damage x 100 / 209 = 478 damage taken.

478 / 2240 = 20% of max health taken.

Tank: 1890 + 1050 = 2940 health, with 269 protections (69 + 160)

1000 base physical damage x 100 / 369 = 271 damage taken.

271 / 2940 = 9.2% of max health taken.

10.8 (difference) / 20 = 54% relative damage reduction (health-based). Or in other words, slap on fifty-four percent damage reduction onto the hybrid build, and that's tank Thanatos.

Relative to raw damage, you'll still be taking 43% less damage than the hybrid build.

*League's own Trinity Force, a common bruiser item, has the same concept (only working off of BASE AD**), deals around 220 bonus damage every 1.5 seconds, without any need to build physical power.) You can see why its a bruiser item. You can also see why Hydra's Lament is terrible, and always was terrible (back when it was 125% of base AD), in comparison.

**Base AD in League goes way higher - even supports*** get around 88, and its common for melee characters to get over 110. Honestly, I think this is better than Smite, simply because there is way too much emphasis on abilities and crits right now.

***Meaning support mages.

Renowned (112)
Posts: 4262
View My Blog

All junglers that fall off that hard are usually built tanky. Thor, Thanatos, Awilix, Fenrir, and Arachne all can build tanky late game with a decent team.

Gods with high base damage but low scalings can be built for damage but instead of going for power, you just build pen.

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Renowned (105)
Posts: 2640
View My Blog

wrote:

**Base AD in League goes way higher - even supports*** get around 88, and its common for melee characters to get over 110. Honestly, I think this is better than Smite, simply because there is way too much emphasis on abilities and crits right now.

gotta agree with smite beign way to crit and ability focussed playing a warrior is mostly for extra tanking. basic attacks just don't do a lot of damage (making an item I still build a lot as the 4% is a bit more)

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Renowned (105)
Posts: 4410
View My Blog

I haven't made a god guide yet, but where exactly would a person find what is "meta" or not? For example, if I were to make an Odin guide, I wouldn't know what the meta is for him; I would simply post the items I chose, why I chose them, and more relevant data.

Notable (2)
Posts: 22

wrote:

You can look up what others build on tiermonster to see if what you build strictly deviates from the more common builds. There are also certain standards that go across all gods that you learn, like always building movement speed and penetration if you want to deal damage. Generally if one truly has wisdom of a god, you've learned what they're good at and are willing to share.

As an only novice but well informed player, I know he has a strong early game and a weak late game. I also know that he is ability rather than auto-attack focused. You can see this because he has no basic attack chain and strong ability damage. Hence I personally start him off with and for ability power damage and move on to defense items later in the game, finishing off with so he does have some late game damage potential. Tiermonster builds for generally build in defenses earlier than me, but I accept I have a more aggressive play style and prefer to play that way.

I also know some tricks like using when playing in the solo lane so that you can return to lane quickly, farm as much as possible, put the pressure on the enemy laner, and rotate when given the chance. Alternatively, if I was playing in the jungle I would know to grab to sustain myself and clear camps quickly. Finally, if I was playing in support, I'd know to grab and to benefit my whole team. I also know that gives me much better engage potential with my ultimate since it allows me to instantly trap a grouping of people and still have the option to leap out of it late game to let my teammates clean up.

This is all coming from someone who doesn't even play that much (I think I'm mastery level 1 or 2). However, don't be afraid to publish a guide that you're unsure of or is trying something new. I published the majority of my guides using builds that weren't meta, and then adapted them based on critique. Some of my guides still use non-meta builds, just make sure you can explain then how and why your build is better.

If you're still having trouble, I did make a guide to making item builds that goes in depth to explain how each item is currently used in the meta and has sections for what the current meta is more or less for each role. Hope this all helps!

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Renowned (132)
Posts: 2074
View My Blog

I personally like experimenting in-game with items as assassins. I think the Thanatos build you made sub could work very well, mostly cause he literally almost to no basic attack usage and has 1 escape that costs health and another is his ultimate. I find it funny how people yell at others for "choosing the wrong items" when they do not realize that they are meta-followers. I have seen a Nemesis do support, I've did a Chronos jungle, and an all assassin team ( we lost but maybe 1 actual support and early ambushes?) I'm all ears for new stuff to try out.

Awards Showcase

Show more awards

Distinguished (50)
Posts: 1132
View My Blog

Build Guide PSA

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

Awards Showcase

Quick Reply

SmiteFire & Smite

Smite Gods