Sub's Tier List :: Page 10

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Sub i think tier lists in all moba's are bad hence why i said games like smite.

never forget dawngate and never forgive EA. Freia will hunt them for eternity.

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Basically what I got from the post replying to my warrior question was

"She would be a good warrior, but this is Smite, and Smite sucks in every way possible, so no."

I think I'll just step out right now. Just remember that a tier list is just purely somebody's opinion, and personally, no offense meant at all to Sub, but since Sub doesn't really play Smite too much anymore, I wouldn't really take the tier list to heart.

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Prominent (40)
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wrote:

Wukong is weird. I've played him support a bit. It can work. But as you said, his lack of "stun the entire enemy team" really, really sucks. And as I mentioned before, being "mid tier" doesn't mean much in this game, which is why I have only two main tiers in my list. He's still strictly worse than many other supports, especially with his lack of AoE CC, which makes him solidly worse, which is why he's still in garbage. I still think Chaac would be a better support.

As for Ymir, there is one problem with him needing Blink: Gold.

The thing is, Ymir is a kill type lane. He can't passively sit back and peel for the entire laning phase like Geb, or heal through it like Sylvanus, or move literally anywhere else like Athena, or poke like ***bha, at least without taking damage himself, which is pretty bad. Without any ability to do anything at range, his lane presence becomes quite weak. Yes, he can peel, but he can't exactly poke, or do anything about being poked.

Also, there's a problem with the wall. Let's say, in lane, you get a freeze on someone. They hop away, and you do the wall to block them off. Now what? You just walk up to them and press 2 and hope it hits? They burned their escape, but you don't have much punishment.

Another problem is with how easily he can be kited. By, say, Apollo, who can just mez and walk away. Or Ullr with his multiple escapes, who can also stun you at your approach, without Blink. Rama is actually pretty weak against Geb, but that's still 2/3 of the mainstream ADCs.

So you can either not get blink, and lose lane presence, or you can sink gold into blink early, falling behind.

I sort of agree that Ymir's stronger than the other garbage supports, but like I said, being behind, even by a little bit, does not bode well in this game. No one will pick Ymir unless there's a whole lot of bans, and from a tactical standpoint, other than his wall, he doesn't really bring anything unique, and most people would pick a cleanse/**** ton of circular CC/mobility/heals/pulls/teleport over a wall.

I see where you're coming from. While I COMPLETELY disagree on Chaac being a better support than Wukong (He's not, trust me on this. I've played support everything), with only two tiers, then yeah, Wukong and Ymir fall into the second category. I wouldn't call it "garbage", but they're certainly worse than the four awesome ones.

Remarkable (7)
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I ask you this Sub:

If you like that in League every champ has a niche, why is it bad that Nemesis isn't the best, but at least has her niche?

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wrote:

Facepalm.

1: I play Smite regularly, if not often, and as you saw in that Joust match, I still kick ***. So much ***. Not to mention my 61% Assault win rate, which I believe is the best in the entire site, lol. (Who DARES challenge me?)

2: If you read it better/carefully and such, you'd see that I saw that Nem just doesn't have what a "meta" warrior needs, and that Smite has a different, more strict meta than League. That's the main problem. If you're filling the warrior role, you need some kind of massive AoE CC AND burst damage - Guan, Herc, Tyr, Chaac, pretty much every warrior has burst and hard CC.

Nemesis was the first attempt, I think, to make a true sustained damage champion. With low cooldowns on her abilities, she, despite being overpowered as ****, was never bursty. But they nerfed her by making her a bursty champ AND reducing damage, meaning she has a sustained damage god's damage but a burst mage's cooldowns, turning her into what she is now.

wrote:

I ask you this Sub:

If you like that in League every champ has a niche, why is it bad that Nemesis isn't the best, but at least has her niche?

And this is the second part why she sucks: Nemesis essentially occupies a worthless niche.

Trundle takes care of tank busting, and that is a niche because in League, there are tanky champions you might actually want to focus. That, and Trundle isn't entirely defined by his ultimate, so his niche isn't so narrow and overspecialized.

In Smite, you ALWAYS need to do something that's defined for you. A wild, out of left field-type niche like tank busting is worthless in Smite, aside from killing a few outlier gods. An assassin NEEDS to kill the enemy squishnuggets. A warrior NEEDS to have AoE CC and burst. A tank NEEDS to have massive CC AND a gimmick. Etc.

And there's another thing: Nemesis doesn't even do her own niche well! Yeah, she takes away 50% of the enemy's protections, but her damage is so low that she relies on her own teammates to kill the tank faster than she can. What kind of ******** is that?

Trundle and Nemesis both have niches, but the difference is that the former occupies a niche you actually want, and does it and other things better, too. The latter occupies a niche that's rarely ever useful, and is mediocre at pretty much everything else.

tl;dr: Nemesis may have a niche, but she sucks at it, can do nothing else well, and the niche itself is unneeded. Just like Ares' niche is pulling the entire enemy team and having a worthless swing chain, Nem's niche is equally useless, which is why she's a terrible god and Trundle is a good champion. It's partly due to the strict burst CC meta of Smite, and partly due to Nemesis seriously having bad design, like that idiotic warrior-assassin-warrior-assassin change.

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wrote:

Sub i think tier lists in all moba's are bad hence why i said games like smite.

You just said "I think tier lists in ALL MOBAs are bad, hec why I said games like Smite."

Um, isn't that exactly what I responded to earlier?

Anyway, to expand on this, tier lists may change with a single patch, but other MOBAs have tier lists anyway. They're useful for multiple reasons: Helping players identify bad champions, helping people find out what champions are weak and too strong for balance purposes, and analyzing the differences between patches to find out what the meta is like.

For example, Evelynn, with the technically entirely neutral jungle changes for season 5, became, in my opinion, complete garbage due to her lack of sustain. Even though she was a beast in season 4.

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Still in amazement to why you think Bacchus has no good CC.

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a knock up leap is his only good cc, the disorient is not disorienting enough but will just make you wobble a bit, heck it can be bad for your team because the adc may not be so good at aiming at iratic movement.

that delayed stun can be interupted... you know who in smite has cc that can interupt it? lot's o godz.

IMO he never had no good cc, he always had one hail o marie but nothing else.

never forget dawngate and never forgive EA. Freia will hunt them for eternity.

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wrote:

Still in amazement to why you think Bacchus has no good CC

I'd have to agree with Greenevers here, is able to do a lot of things with both and . Firstly is extremely disruptive and incredibly good for invading early game. Secondly makes it extremely hard to land abilities and decreases their potency. Both of these are effective CC. As for , the stun lands most of the time, and it deals damage. You can compensate with lack of a 100% of the time stun with damage when peeling.

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intoxicate hardly makes it harder, it shakes you view a little bit but if you are good with the skill shots already its not going to be much harder to hit it while intoxicated, so no not extremly hard but a tiny bit harder.

belch of the god does potato damage, at level one it does 80 raw damage not including natural protections, at max rank it does a max of 350. compared to most other tanks this is still bad.

lack of 100% of the time stun is cutting it a little close.

list of gods that i know of that can interupt it.

agni
anhur
anubi
aphro
apollo
art
athena
other bacchuses
chaac
chang'e
chronos
cupid
fenrir
freya
geb
hades
he bo
herc
batz
isis
kali
kukulkan
***bha
loki
merc
ne zha
neith
nox
pos
serqet
sobek
sun
sylvanus
than
thor
tyr
ullr
vamana
vulcan
ymir
zeus
zhong

haven't even included everyone who can escape from it or can cc immunity them selves.

the ones i am missing of those would be

arachne
ares
art
baka
bastet
guan
hel
nem
nu wa
odin
ra
rama
xbal

keep in mind that these are the only ones i actually know enough about of the kits of, i dont know what cabra's kit is nor janus. if these can also easely escape it then they can be added to either of the lists.

the skill does not make up for the lack of stun with its damage because its damage is still bad. early game belly flop out damage's it, late game for a tank it still does really bad damage even when getting all the ticks of.

aside from the fact that almost all gods can escape it in some form.

intoxicate's wobble should be bigger if you actually want to make it a worth while cc compared to litterly stunning entire teams of knocking up entire teams.

never forget dawngate and never forgive EA. Freia will hunt them for eternity.

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