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was considering trying out duel, but...

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Forum » General Discussion » was considering trying out duel, but... 41 posts - page 2 of 5
Permalink | Quote | +Rep by silentshell » July 17, 2020 12:09pm | Report
Branmuffin17 wrote:

In most cases against a single opponent, you would avoid items that provide dual protections, since you're mostly only going to take damage from one source. It's very, very easy when the enemy is physical, since minions, towers etc. all do physical damage.

It's a bit different perhaps when facing a magical enemy, since if you're fighting among the minions, or diving under their tower, you could take both types.

But for the most part, I'd say it would be very situational. So where I see one of your builds has Berserker's and Bulwark, you just wouldn't do that. If you're facing physical, Berserker's is fine but instead of Bulwark, get Contagion or Midgardian or Blackthorn or whatever that's not so focused on magical.



That is what i was thinking but i was thinking about the minions and also the bull demon and the buff camps and i was also considering the passives as well.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by silentshell » July 17, 2020 12:17pm | Report
boogiebass wrote:

You have to start eventually. Arena is fine and all, but you're not getting the full smite experience if that's all you play. If you're afraid of getting BMed by your team for playing bad, then play with friends.



Yeah, at some point in the back of my head i do want to get back into joust...maybe clash at some point...conquest and siege i don't think i'll ever be interested in really trying to pick them up.

For whatever reason, at least initially, duel seems like the best bet for me to jump in and expand if i do add another game mode in. It seems to be in a weird spot where it is both more specific and less specific with countering at the same time. You don't have to worry about all kinds of different x factors and possible counters from multiple players but you have to be able to specifically counter a specific character and their kit.

In arena you still counter, but you can get away with a lot more and still live a lot of the time.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Kriega1 » July 17, 2020 12:19pm | Report
silentshell wrote:




That is what i was thinking but i was thinking about the minions and also the bull demon and the buff camps and i was also considering the passives as well.


Never build prots that isn't the type of damage your duel opponent has, there are very few exceptions I can think of, like Magi's cloak (and thats not built as the primary defense item) but 99% of the time that is the general rule.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by silentshell » July 17, 2020 12:32pm | Report
Kriega1 wrote:



Never build prots that isn't the type of damage your duel opponent has, there are very few exceptions I can think of, like Magi's cloak (and thats not built as the primary defense item) but 99% of the time that is the general rule.



Appreciate the feedback. With those builds I was putting them out as templates based on my thoughts and ignorance on how it works in duel. I've already modified the builds i listed earlier based on your's and bran's feedback.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Gulfwulf » July 17, 2020 1:23pm | Report
Ymir: Either start with Hunter's Blessing, Tiny Trinket, and 2x Healing Potions and Mana Potions OR Talon Trinket and 1x each potion type. Build Shoes of Focus, Bancroft's Talon, either Breastplate of Valor against physical or Genji's Guard against magical (build Pestilence against Hel, Aphrodite, and Anubis), Demonic Grip, Telkhines Ring, Toxic Blade if needed for anti-heal, and Polynomicon. If your opponent builds crit, replace bov/genji's with Spectral Armor.

Levelling order is: 2x Glacial Strike and 1x Frost Breath at the beginning, then 1x ice wall] at level 4, and 1x [[shards of ice at level 5. Prioritize gs, then fb, then iw. Put points into soi when you can. Use gs for wave and camp clear, and fb for poke, CC. When you're attacking objectives once you have poly online, strike the wave/camp, then use basics until either Poly's reset or your opponent is attacking you. Proper use of Poly combined with the AS from demonic can pump out some crazy damage. Go watch how Hatmaster plays Ymir for some real pointers; he almost exclusively plays guardians, so he's a good source for Ymir. By the way, do NOT play Terra in duel; her cooldowns are way to long and her abilities are to easy to juke. Save your hair and try someone else like Vulcan or Bellona. Good players will generally ban Skadi, Ullr, He Bo, and AMC. Chaac is okay in duel provided you can get an early lead, but he tends to fall off late, so you have to be careful with him. Also keep an eye out for opponents who will backdoor you by ignoring you and going straight for your phoenix and/or Titan. So by wards and keep them up as much as possible.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by silentshell » July 17, 2020 1:46pm | Report
Gulfwulf wrote:

Ymir: Either start with Hunter's Blessing, Tiny Trinket, and 2x Healing Potions and Mana Potions OR Talon Trinket and 1x each potion type. Build Shoes of Focus, Bancroft's Talon, either Breastplate of Valor against physical or Genji's Guard against magical (build Pestilence against Hel, Aphrodite, and Anubis), Demonic Grip, Telkhines Ring, Toxic Blade if needed for anti-heal, and Polynomicon. If your opponent builds crit, replace bov/genji's with Spectral Armor.

Levelling order is: 2x Glacial Strike and 1x Frost Breath at the beginning, then 1x ice wall] at level 4, and 1x [[shards of ice at level 5. Prioritize gs, then fb, then iw. Put points into soi when you can. Use gs for wave and camp clear, and fb for poke, CC. When you're attacking objectives once you have poly online, strike the wave/camp, then use basics until either Poly's reset or your opponent is attacking you. Proper use of Poly combined with the AS from demonic can pump out some crazy damage. Go watch how Hatmaster plays Ymir for some real pointers; he almost exclusively plays guardians, so he's a good source for Ymir. By the way, do NOT play Terra in duel; her cooldowns are way to long and her abilities are to easy to juke. Save your hair and try someone else like Vulcan or Bellona. Good players will generally ban Skadi, Ullr, He Bo, and AMC. Chaac is okay in duel provided you can get an early lead, but he tends to fall off late, so you have to be careful with him. Also keep an eye out for opponents who will backdoor you by ignoring you and going straight for your phoenix and/or Titan. So by wards and keep them up as much as possible.


Thanks for all of the stategy and advice. Before i started looking at builds and picking which characters to use I looked up the 7.7 tierlist for duel off of smiteguru. Bellona is he first character i will try there if i make that jump. I am decent enough, if a bit rusty currently, with Odin so he may be an option far down the line. After Bell, it will probably be Vulcan or Poseidon next.

I went through the top few tiers of smiteguru's list to specifically see who was in there that i feel confident with. Ymir is one that i would probably end up trying but probably after getting my feet wet some. I know for sure right now i would probably not use that build example very well. lol.

For hunters I am probably best with Ah Muzen Cab, but i have nowhere near as much experience with him as i do with Artemis and Hou Yi. Art is pretty far down the tier list for duel from what i saw as well, which is natural since she doesn't have a true escape. I imagine that AMC is so very good in duel because he can conveniently place those hives for built in tracking and be a lot more proactive than a lot of other gods.


I was surprised that Ares was so far down the list, i figured he would be a better choice than he shows to be from the tier list.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Devampi » July 17, 2020 1:58pm | Report
duel is its own cup of tea. every match is different and it can go from a fighting opponent to a backdooring one (as the maps allows it)

Just a general note about your concept builds. I think you're quite stuck in a regular team mindset, while duel is a lot if not all about counterbuilding. The reason for saying this is just looking at the number of prot items you have.

What I have noticed from youtube is that in most cases you will see a damage item start into boots into defense into other counter items (anti heal most often and pen). With your build an opponent will just get a big % pen item. Then you lack the damage to kill him as he countered a big part of your build.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by silentshell » July 17, 2020 2:41pm | Report
Devampi wrote:

duel is its own cup of tea. every match is different and it can go from a fighting opponent to a backdooring one (as the maps allows it)

Just a general note about your concept builds. I think you're quite stuck in a regular team mindset, while duel is a lot if not all about counterbuilding. The reason for saying this is just looking at the number of prot items you have.

What I have noticed from youtube is that in most cases you will see a damage item start into boots into defense into other counter items (anti heal most often and pen). With your build an opponent will just get a big % pen item. Then you lack the damage to kill him as he countered a big part of your build.



so as a few random examples of that concept--

Bellona
Berserker's Shield-> Ninja Tabi-> Pestilence-> Serrated Edge-> Ancile-> Winged Blade

Poseidon
Spear of Desolation-> Shoes of Focus-> Bancroft's Talon-> Chronos' Pendant-> Divine Ruin-> Gem of Isolation

Ah Muzen Cab
Transcendence-> Ninja Tabi-> The Crusher-> Gladiator's Shield-> Atalanta's Bow-> Magi's Cloak
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Gulfwulf » July 17, 2020 5:10pm | Report
Get soul reaver or ob shard instead of deso on Pos.
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Permalink | Quote | +Rep by Gulfwulf » July 17, 2020 8:03pm | Report
You're in the wrong mindset for duel, Shell. It's you against your opponent, not you and your team against the opposing team, so you need items that directly benefit you.

So, for physical (in no particular order):

Attacker's Blessing
Transcendence
Ninja Tabi
Breastplate of Valor/ Genji's Guard (alts are Pestilence or Shogun's Kusari)
The Crusher
Brawler's Beat Stick
Toxic Blade
The Executioner (sure it was nerfed, but it still has decent 1v1 damage and AS).
Qin's Sais
Heartseeker
Frostbound Hammer
Titan's Bane (your go-to physical pen item)
Hastened Katana
Ichaival
Serrated Edge/ Soul Eater

The shields don't really offer much for a 1v1 fight, so I would stay away from them. Sure Void Shield has the same protection as bov, but its passive doesn't affect minions and jungle camps, nor does it have the CDR the latter has. Runic Shield's passive doesn't really compare to genji's stats, so I would avoid it as well.

I'll write-up a magical version later, but it follows the same thought-process as the physical, except you use Bancroft's Talon instead of trans for your power.
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