Let's Make Patch Notes - Hunters/ADCs :: Page 12

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Could work, but I think her base attack speed is already low enough, and her base abilities do't deal that much damage all together - apart from , she has more utility rather than power coming from those abilities. But a slight change could work...

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I just noticed...

Neith has a faster base attack speed than both Artemis and Apollo. This is kinda... wrong. While both Apollo and Artemis have attack speed based steroids, they should still have a faster base attack speed than Neith, as Neith is a hybrid auto attacks / caster Hunter.

So, regardless of everything, I think we should either reduce her base attack speed or increase Apollo's and Artemis'.

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wrote:

I disagree. Even though has a bigger attack speed, she lacks damage on her auto attacks. And her abilities doesn't hurt THAT much( Maybe only and ). So, basically trades her Auto attack damage for Attack Speed + Ability Damage.

Nerfing would be wrong, and buffing and as well. already has a huge Attack Speed + Auto Attack Damage, so does . And their abilities still hurt.

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Well, when you look at it in a straight up manly boxing match sure, but what about other things? Leave Apollo aside - look at Neith Vs. Artemis

Neith's base abilities deal a lot of damage and provide great utility - lots of CC, sustain, and a jump. And her abilities can deal A LOT of damage. Look at the broken weave damage of spirit arrow, and don't underestimate the damage of and backflip. She also has great poke, and did I mention the attack speed debuff and ? ad the duration? and its radius and range? Also, her ultimate provides another form of extremely useful CC with unlimited range that provides excellent global presence. The total damage from her abilities is 1220 + 360% contribution.

Artemis' base abilities deal quite some damage as well, but if you don't look at it from, a narrow perspective, transgressors fate isn't as viable for damage as, let's say, . It's almost impossible to hit without any form of CC to help you. Sure, Art maybe has a better poke, but other than that... Neith has better sustain, she is much safer, more CC, global presence... Sure, is better if you are fighting more than one god compared to , and sure, art has a steroids, but I just feel that she is weak compared to Neith. Artemis has a total of

I might be by***, and I think I am, but I don't mind if you leave Neith as she is, but for a goddess that is so auto-attack focused, you can't give less attack speed to one that is also ability focused.

All Hunters other than Art, Neith and Apollo have higher base attack speed. Why shouldn't Art have one when she is the most auto attack based one? Even Xbalanque, who is supposed to have hardest hitting auto attacks in the game, has a higher base attack speed. Also Cupid, who, much like Artemis, has an attack speed steroid, has higher base attack speed.

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Ehm, I don't have any suggestions right now, but let's get this straight.
You guys think has a good early game? That is honestly not true, just look at , that guy has a great early game, not . He needs an all around buff to compete with other ADCs. He lacks proper CC of / or the crazy mobility of . His heal is also doesn't make for a good mid game like 's and is mostly useles past 5 minutes unless you want to heal up your support, which you shouldn't be doing as an ADC anyways.

is not a hyper carry. While her attack speed steroid is pretty nice her passive is really bad, her traps don't help with doing anything late or early, her nuke is mediocre at most and her ult can be pretty much countered 100% by aegis and beads (while 's ult can be countered by aegis to it doeals more damage and is kind of AEO, Neith's ult is used to finish off people when their aegis is probably down already or you make them blow it to let them live :p and aegis and beads doesn't do much against 's ult since it's not really about damage or cc anyways). All other carries except cupid outshine her with the utility, the only thing she has got is more attack speed and a little more crit chance and that doesn't instantly call: hyper mega super carry.

Just my thoughst tho.

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I rarely get to play against a , but I've been told that an aggressive Cupid - One that will dash at you and then use and start auto attacking is a real pin in the ***. His early game used to be much stronger before they nerfed him. Now he is one of the weakest Hunters overall, but I believe what I've been told - that he is still quite strong early game. True, does have a super-strong early game compared to all Hunters, and we suggested nerfing him as well.

Artemis is a hyper carry. Saying that you can simply aegis her ult is an invalid argument. You can pretty much aegis every ult, aside from maybe as it's too unpredictable and fast. And Tusky can affect up to 3 people and he gives her 3 seconds of CC immunity. Also, her traps are not worthless. They are one of the strongest abilities in the game. It's just that they are so hard to hit they seem ineffective and useless. But they are devastating if you can pull them off - to do that you'll mainly need the help of another form of hard CC. If you pare Tusky with transgressors fate you can hold someone down for up to 3.5 seconds. That's a lot. And with , that's more than enough time to take down almost any god you want to late game.
Claiming she is not a hyper carry is just simply wrong. What makes Mercury a hyper carry that Artemis doesn't have? or Kali? or Chronos? These are pretty much all of the hyper carries in the game, and all of them have a ****ty early game and a monstrous late game (apart from Mercury - he is less extreme). They are all auto-attack focused, and they are all built for late game carnage.

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Cupids heart bomb should only stick to gods and just go through minions while still damaging them, ofc sick plays like stuns off of hit minions wouldn't be possible anymore, but his early game would be much better.

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Cupid used to have a good early game, but it weakened as waveclear became the top priority. It's still really, really good, with his insane in-lane sustain on top of his massive burst. His main draw was his damage and his CC, and as soon as they lowered that damage, he fell slightly. That said, I still consider his early game to be one of the best, even if it's no longer THE best.

I refer to Artemis as a hyper carry because that is what she is supposed to be. Terribad early, fantastic late, except that Power Creep has turned her to God-****ing-awful early, mediocre late. She's crippled by her lack of mobility, and he steroid isn't even that great anymore, and now that everyone has CC, her lack of CC really hurts her.

Silver, your change to Heart Bomb is really interesting, because that means it'd be really difficult to avoid being stunned, which translates to his early game being once again ridiculously strong. I LIKE it.

Jordenito, I'm working on it, but it's slow, because I keep procrastinating. I've finished the basic-attack mages, and I thought it'd be best to post subreports, because one big report on every single mage would be rather overwhelming. I'll probably post it on the Mages thread in a few hours.

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Could it be possible to give Artemis's 3 larger area, so that if she has stacked the minion wave with basic attacks, she can hit the whole wave. Combined with the suggested piercing on her 2, she would be able to clear a wave fairly easily.

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For would it be possible to disorientate enemies (make the look in a random direction as soon as is activated, so the enemy wouldn't be able to tell which way they are running.

Or perhaps enemies would could be crippled if attacked by Xbalanque during the duration, or just receive a movement speed debuff.

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